You may have heard the term “flow state” from big wave surfers, symphony performers, or chess players. You may have even heard it applied to downhill mountain biking or enduro. But that state of utter concentration, where skill meets challenge at just the right inflection point, can happen on any ride.

Here, we talked with Sue Jackson, founder of the Flow Centre in Australia and co-author of Flow in Sports: The Keys to Optimal Experiences and Performances to get a better understanding of the elusive concept of flow and how to make it work for us on the bike. Jackson, an endurance athlete and open-water swimmer, actually wrote the book with the person who coined the term flow state back in 1975, Mihaly Csikszentmihalyi.

What is flow state?

The concept of flow actually came from descriptions of people Csikszentmihalyi interviewed, when he was asking them to describe what it feels like when you’re totally focused on what you’re doing, explains Jackson. “People kept saying that things seem to flow from one moment to the next, and it felt effortless, even though if you’re involved in an intense situation, it’s not effortless,” she says. “But the perception is of effortlessness.”

According to Csikszentmihalyi, flow occurs when you’re in a challenging situation where you have the skills to meet the challenge. “You’ve got high skills, high challenge with the challenge outweighing the skills by a little bit,” says Jackson. “That’s always an individual equation: For the new surfer paddling into a 10-foot-high wave for the first time, he’s likely experiencing anxiety rather than flow, which occurs when the challenges outweigh our skills. Conversely, boredom occurs when our skills outweigh the challenge.”

Boredom is that same hill you’ve ridden up thousands of times: It’s not a bad thing, but it’s unlikely to put you into a flow state on the ride, unless you’re also pushing to hit a new FTP on this repetition of the climb. Conversely, a new cyclist may look at that same hill and feel anxious because it’s steeper or longer than anything they’ve ever climbed.

To find the sweet spot of flow in training, you’re hitting right in the middle of those two extremes, getting to a place where you can meet the challenge and enjoy conquering it.

How do you find your flow state?

The meta question that must be asked: Does knowing about flow state and looking for it in your riding actually hurt your ability to get into that state?

“When you’re thinking about something, you’re not actually fully engaged in it,” says Jackson. “One of the characteristics of flow that makes it so enjoyable is that we can have those moments where we can just let go of the analysis, the thinking, and the worrying. A characteristic of being in flow is that you drop out of that self-consciousness place and just start to get immersed in what you’re doing.”

That said, some postride reflection about flow is a good thing. In her research, Jackson noticed that prompting athletes to think about flow after the fact actually increased their enjoyment and understanding of their sport. “I was struck by how at the end of these interviews, athletes would invariably thank me for an opportunity to speak to someone about their experience in sport as opposed to their performance. I think that that’s an important reminder that we’re doing sport because we love the experience of being able to challenge our bodies and our minds and reach new goals.”

Now, for Jackson, the ocean is an easy place to experience flow because while Australia is packed with things that can kill you, from riptides to sharks, she has the skills down to meet the challenge. “The ocean is a beautiful place to be and it does require that you bring your attention to what you’re doing so that you do stay on course and don’t get swept out to somewhere else,” she says. “The ocean has constantly changing conditions, so you have to be in the moment.”

More extreme types of cycling—downhill mountain biking, for instance—add a heightened level of challenge because the risk level rises. (Just like open-water swimming versus doing a time trial in a pool.)

What that means is that when you’re in a challenging situation on the bike, whether it’s climbing a steep hill or doing an FTP test on Zwift, and it requires you to focus all your attention on the task at hand, you may fall into flow state even if the challenge is more mental than life-threatening.

Because of this, you don’t need to be a longtime cyclist to experience flow. You need a certain skill prerequisite so that you can pedal your bike around without really thinking about braking, shifting, cornering, or other basic skills. But once you have those skills mastered, flow comes from finding the sweet spot where you’re being challenged, but you’re not anxious about it. You’re in the moment, tackling a tough pursuit, and you’re loving it.

“You need to have the basics, but then you can modify your challenge on the bike so that you’re able to experience some level of flow,” says Jackson. As you improve on the bike, the level of challenge that you take on will rise in response to that.

However, flow isn’t guaranteed, even on a challenging ride. If you’re chatting with a friend on a long ride, or you’re listening to a podcast, you won’t be able to be totally focused on the task at hand, which is a key factor to being in flow. “It’s fine to ride with friends or to listen to podcasts,” Jackson says. “But just don’t expect to also experience flow while you’re really paying attention to the podcast.”

Also, being fully in the moment can mean watching your heart rate or power on the computer, or making sure you’re still on course. That’s all part of the cycling experience, says Jackson. “If what you’re looking at is tied back into what you’re doing and to your performance, and you’re able to adjust things based on that data, that feedback will keep you in flow,” she says. “One of the characteristics that helps us get into flow is paying attention to feedback that we’re getting during the activity. So if the feedback is relevant, great. If your cycling computer is popping up calls and texts, that’s less helpful.”

What are the pros and cons of flow state training?

Reading this, you may be inclined to compare flow state to the oft-cited “runner’s high” that those in the running world like to brag about to us cyclists. It’s similar, yes, but it’s not entirely the same thing.

A runner’s high, Jackson explains, is a very physical reaction to running, when your body experiences a surge of the feel-good hormone, endorphin. “Flow might happen at the same time as a runner’s high, but it’s not exactly the same thing,” she explains. “Flow is a psychological state, it’s a state of total focus on the task at hand. You know you’re there when the task feels effortless, the concentration feels easier to maintain, you lose self-consciousness, and you have a feeling of being in control.”

You may also notice that time seems to be slowing down or speeding up, depending on the activity. For downhill mountain bikers, time will likely feel slowed down as they seem to experience each and every rock, corner, and root on course. For someone in the middle of a hard interval ride or tough climb, time may speed up so it feels like you’re done in the blink of an eye.

In cycling, there’s little downside to striving for flow state, though in more extreme sports, the relentless pursuit of flow can put you in some dangerous circumstances as you need to constantly find greater and greater challenges.

“If you’re a flow seeker in an extreme sport, then you probably need to be wary of where the line between pursuing flow and becoming reckless is,” says Jackson. “But generally, flow is a very positive experience and a very enhancing experience for us as human beings.”

If you’re injured and unable to ride, you may be feeling a distinct lack of flow in your life. But Jackson says you can use your previous interactions with flow on the bike to apply it to other areas of your life, as well. “If you’re not able to experience flow in the main domain that you would normally experience it in, then look for other activities you can do. You can find flow in music or writing or reading—if someone’s really injured and they can’t take part in any physical activity, then they might find some other hobby where they can experience flow.”

Finally: Don’t force yourself to find flow, because if you start looking for it, it will become more elusive. “It takes a very high level of mental discipline to notice being in flow and not start drifting out of it,” Jackson says. “You tend to notice it more in retrospect, thinking back to a moment in your ride.”